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Archive of: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum
Archive desc: The Internet home for the Heinlein Forum
Archived by: webnews@sff.net
Archive date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 03:18:17
============================================================
Article 21714
From: noone"
Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 00:29:22 -0400
Subject: Re: Harry Potter's Female Fans
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum
could she really have been saying that with a straight face? evidently she's
never heard the old joke about why witches don't wear knickers.
"gunner"
"Eli Hestermann" <Eli_Hestermann@dfci.harvard.edu> wrote in message
news:3D74EE71.7FBFC1@dfci.harvard.edu...
> LMAO!
>
> My favorite customer review was from "poola13 from Ohio", who isn't even
> curious why both the 12- and 17-year old like to play with it.
>
> --
> Eli V. Hestermann
> Eli_Hestermann@dfci.harvard.edu
> "Vita brevis est, ars longa." -Seneca
>
>
------------------------------------------------------------
Article 21715
From: TreetopAngel"
Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 01:15:09 -0600
Subject: Re: Harry Potter's Female Fans
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum
<filksinger@earthling.net> wrote in message news:3d74e242.0@news.sff.net...
> Normally, I'd just chuckle at this and ignore it, but this one really hits
> my funny bone. It may also explain Harry Potter's popularity with young
> girls.:)
>
>
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/stores/detail/-/toys/B00005NEBW/qid%3D1
030224308/sr%3D2-2/ref%3Dsr%5F2%5F2/102-4729042-7959361
Old girls like him and possibly the Nimbus 2000, too!
Elizabeth
------------------------------------------------------------
Article 21716
From: TreetopAngel"
Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 01:17:02 -0600
Subject: Re: Harry Potter's Female Fans
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum
"noone" <no_one@home> wrote in message news:3d758c5e.0@news.sff.net...
> could she really have been saying that with a straight face? evidently
she's
> never heard the old joke about why witches don't wear knickers.
> "gunner"
All right Gunner, why don't witches wear knickers?? ;-)
Elizabeth
------------------------------------------------------------
Article 21717
From: Voxwoman
Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2002 12:54:58 -0400
Subject: Re: Harry Potter's Female Fans
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum
and it also cures the vapors ;)
filksinger@earthling.net wrote:
> Normally, I'd just chuckle at this and ignore it, but this one really hits
> my funny bone. It may also explain Harry Potter's popularity with young
> girls.:)
>
> http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/stores/detail/-/toys/B00005NEBW/qid%3D1030224308/sr%3D2-2/ref%3Dsr%5F2%5F2/102-4729042-7959361
>
------------------------------------------------------------
Article 21718
From: noone"
Date: Thu, 5 Sep 2002 03:07:46 -0400
Subject: Re: Harry Potter's Female Fans
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum
why to get a better grip on the broomstick.
"gunner"
--------------
"TreetopAngel" <zyoumans@bigsky.net> wrote in message
news:3d75b38f.0@news.sff.net...
>
> "noone" <no_one@home> wrote in message news:3d758c5e.0@news.sff.net...
> > could she really have been saying that with a straight face? evidently
> she's
> > never heard the old joke about why witches don't wear knickers.
> > "gunner"
>
> All right Gunner, why don't witches wear knickers?? ;-)
>
> Elizabeth
>
>
------------------------------------------------------------
Article 21719
From: hf_jai@prodigy.net (Jai Johnson-Pickett)
Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2002 15:02:44 GMT
Subject: Re: Out of Control?
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum
On Mon, 2 Sep 2002 19:30:56 -0700, "Lorrita Morgan"
<lorrita-m@prodigy.net> wrote:
>Jai,
>Just this week we get Germany refusing to share evidence relating to
>September 11 unless the death penalty option is removed from the "20th
>Hijacker's" trial. So yes, I believe that there are people of education and
>what passes for reason who think that a war can be and should be fought
>without involving any noncombatants. And not just because I read Tom
>Clancy, Randy Alcorn, Frank Peretti, Stephen King, Harry Turtledove, Harry
>Harrison, and a host of other writers of speculative fiction.
>
>Some of these deluded people are in positions of power and decision makers.
>They shout the loudest and longest in the negative when ever logic rears her
>head.
I think you may be mixing apples and orange, using Germany's death
penalty objections to somehow indicate that the Germans think war can
be fought without killing civilians. This is not a new stand for
Germany--I can remember at least one case where the Germans maintained
custody of a GI who had murdered a German civilian, a taxi driver
iirc, because they didn't want him, the GI, subject to the death
penalty. I think something similar happened in Belgium or the
Netherlands not too long ago, but before 9/11. Most of the European
governments take that position, and just recently Pres Fox of Mexico
got all bent out of shape, allegedly snubbed Pres Bush, because Texas
executed a Mexican national. I may be wrong, but I'm thinking the US
is the only Western nation which does have a death penalty?
Personally, I (reluctantly and with reservation) support executions
for especially heinous crimes, but it does give one pause.
Be that as it may, it's quite a stretch to say that the Europeans will
squawk too loudy it we go it alone against Iraq, much less actually DO
anything about it, based upon a death penalty case, terrorism-related
or not. Ultimately, they will say or do what they feel is in their
national interests. Photos of dead Iraqi children will cause some
outrage (as well they should, even here), but will be as quickly
forgotten by those living safe and warm with their TVs tuned to MTV or
whatever the European equivalent is these days. High oil prices will
cause a harsher reaction.
>We have been focused mainly on the old "Silk Road" and not looking at the
>rest of the world. We're playing the race/religion profile and not looking
>at the homegrown jerks who might be even more deadly. We haven't looked at
>some of the groups to the south that scare me because if that sieve we call
>a border with Mexico can't stop braceros then how will it stop "Shining
>Path" or its offspring/clones. The border to the north isn't much better
>and Canada has some interesting groups that I wouldn't want to see down
>here.
Oh, I certainly agree that there is a far larger problem than just the
Islamic terrorists. I don't see a very effective long-range plan
addressing that larger threat and fear the current administration just
doesn't "get it." Otoh, I have no great ideas on what the answer is.
But I don't see how you can deny that al-Qaida, Hamas, Islamic
Brotherhood, etc, (they really are all the same) and the governments
which shelter them, pose the most _immediate_ threat. Call it
"race/religion profiling" if you will. They are the ones who attacked
us on 9/11, and many many times before. They are the ones murdering
missionaries in the Philippines (and I have no great sympathy for
missionaries), trying to force nuclear confrontation in Kashmir,
blowing up pizza parlors and university lunchrooms in Israel.
>So what do we do? I think we try to get to know our neighbors, first.
>Then, we expand to joining groups like political parties, PTAs, fraternal
>organizations, etc. and keep our ears open. Learn true logic -- ask
>yourself what they're selling and how. (Reread "If This Goes On..."
>especially the discussion on semantics.) Make an acquaintance of a
>different ethnic/social/religious background -- you should have one or two
>things in common. Maybe this doesn't change the way you view the world, but
>you may become more aware of how others see the world.
Don't talk down to me, 'Rita. I have many acquaintances, even
friends, who are of various "ethnic/social/religious" backgrounds.
Some of them are even Muslims and Arabs. If fact, I daresay I've
probably spoken with more Muslims, some American but mostly from
Islamic nations, than most if not all of the people who frequent the
Forum. I've also lived overseas. In Europe, for 5 years. And in
Korea for one, altho I'll grant you, the latter was a long time ago
and I didn't have much opportunity to speak with Koreans then (some,
but not much)--but I did read THEIR newpapers (in translation, of
course) and follow their politics--it was my job.
Perhaps you should spend some time reading what the jihadists have to
say about the US and all us infidels. And believe that they really do
mean what they say. And know that they are very smart people, who are
more than capable of using technology, communications, financial
networks and whatever else it takes to further their cause.
The let's-all-get-to-know-each-other-and-be-friends approach is just
not gonna work.
------------------------------------------------------------
Article 21720
From: filksinger@earthling.net
Date: 5 Sep 2002 16:52:12 GMT
Subject: Computer Games Illegal
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum
It appears that the Greek government can't tell the difference between video
poker and Doom, so they've banned them all.
http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/4/26939.html
Laugh or cry? Decisions, decisions.
--
Filksinger
AKA David Nasset, Sr.
Geek Prophet to the Technologically Declined
------------------------------------------------------------
Article 21721
From: Dee"
Date: Thu, 5 Sep 2002 14:16:34 -0500
Subject: Re: Out of Control?
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum
'Rita wrote:
> >So what do we do? I think we try to get to know our neighbors, first.
> >Then, we expand to joining groups like political parties, PTAs, fraternal
> >organizations, etc. and keep our ears open. Learn true logic -- ask
> >yourself what they're selling and how. (Reread "If This Goes On..."
> >especially the discussion on semantics.) Make an acquaintance of a
> >different ethnic/social/religious background -- you should have one or
two
> >things in common. Maybe this doesn't change the way you view the world,
but
> >you may become more aware of how others see the world.
Jai wrote:
> Don't talk down to me, 'Rita. I have many acquaintances, even
> friends, who are of various "ethnic/social/religious" backgrounds.
> Some of them are even Muslims and Arabs. If fact, I daresay I've
> probably spoken with more Muslims, some American but mostly from
> Islamic nations, than most if not all of the people who frequent the
> Forum. I've also lived overseas. In Europe, for 5 years. And in
> Korea for one, altho I'll grant you, the latter was a long time ago
> and I didn't have much opportunity to speak with Koreans then (some,
> but not much)--but I did read THEIR newpapers (in translation, of
> course) and follow their politics--it was my job.
> Perhaps you should spend some time reading what the jihadists have to
> say about the US and all us infidels. And believe that they really do
> mean what they say. And know that they are very smart people, who are
> more than capable of using technology, communications, financial
> networks and whatever else it takes to further their cause.
Jai--
I don;t think 'rita meant you, personally. Especially since she started
with "we", I suspect that was an impersonal you, including even heself. And
most of us would benefit from broadening our horizons.
> The let's-all-get-to-know-each-other-and-be-friends approach is just
> not gonna work.
Agreed, if you mean won't work to stop the terrorism. But getting to
know each other might help us remember that not all Muslims are terrorists,
and not all terrorists are Muslims, which I think is where 'rita was going.
Some of us lose focus sometimes, and need to remind ourselves that, while
the threat is very real, it may not be simple.
As for you personally, professional and personal interest probably make
you one of the more informed people on the Forum. But if 'rita was saying
that, as a people we sometimes get tunnel vision, she's right, I think.
--Dee2
------------------------------------------------------------
Article 21722
From: William J. Keaton"
Date: Thu, 5 Sep 2002 22:17:44 -0400
Subject: Re: Nobody else posted it
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum
"Lorrita Morgan" <lorrita-m@prodigy.net> wrote in message
news:3d701c0f.0@news.sff.net...
> the Beloit College Class of 2006 "Mindset" List
>
That one commencement address, and the annual list it hs spawned has done
more for my alma mater than anything else. I'm amazed every time I hear
about it on the news.
Or Internet. Thanks `rita!
WJaKe
------------------------------------------------------------
Article 21723
From: Michael P. Calligaro"
Date: Thu, 5 Sep 2002 20:05:56 -0700
Subject: Re: Computer Games Illegal
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum
It completely blows my mind. It's basically impossible to buy a computer
these days without some sort of game on it. Yes, playing the solitaire that
comes with windows while in Greece is likely to end you in jail. Can't do
it in public, can't do it in private, can't do it anywhere in the country.
And the fines they're throwing around are just massive. Also, overnight,
they put every game developer in the country out of business. Insanity in
the extreme.
And the reasoning behind this was silly too.
"Online gambling is happening, and we're not getting tax money from it. We
need to stop that. We'll ban all gambling games."
"Can you tell a gambling game from a non-gambling game?"
"Okay, you're right, we can't. In that case, we'll ban all games."
There's no way at all to gamble on a GameBoy, but it's banned too.
So, you shake your head, roll your eyes, and think, "Well, at least our
government isn't that dumb."
Then you remember the Communications Decency Act....
Clearly, what Greece needs is a constitution and a supreme court willing to
protect it. That's all that's saved us form about 10 laws just as bad as
this that our government has passed.
bytor
<filksinger@earthling.net> wrote in message news:3d778bbc.0@news.sff.net...
> It appears that the Greek government can't tell the difference between
video
> poker and Doom, so they've banned them all.
>
> http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/4/26939.html
>
> Laugh or cry? Decisions, decisions.
> --
> Filksinger
> AKA David Nasset, Sr.
> Geek Prophet to the Technologically Declined
------------------------------------------------------------
Article 21724
From: Bill Dauphin
Date: Fri, 06 Sep 2002 00:53:03 -0400
Subject: The Real Purpose for Cats
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum
I don't normally pass along internet jokes, but a friend who doesn't
normally pass them along either sent me one I thought this group, in
particular, would enjoy. Sorry if you've seen it before; I'm pretty sure it
hasn't been posted here:
>>Read it all the way through.
A newly discovered chapter in the Book of Genesis has provided the answer
to: Where do pets come from?
Adam and Eve said, "Lord, when we were in the garden, you walked with us
every day. Now we do not see you any more. We are lonesome here, and it is
difficult for us to remember how much you love us."
And God said, "No problem! I will create a companion for you that will be
with you forever and who will be a reflection of my love for you so that you
will love me even when you cannot see me.
Regardless of how selfish or childish or unlovable you may be, this new
companion will accept you as you are and will love you as I do, in spite of
yourselves."
And God created a new animal to be a companion for Adam and Eve. And it was
a good animal.
And God was pleased. And the new animal was pleased to be with Adam and Eve
and he wagged his tail.
And Adam said, "Lord, I have already named all the animals in the Kingdom
and I cannot think of a name for this new animal."
And God said, "No problem.
Because I have created this new animal to be a reflection of my love for
you, his name will be a reflection of my own name, and you will call him
DOG."
And Dog lived with Adam and Eve and was a companion to them and loved them.
And they were comforted.
And God was pleased. And Dog was content and wagged his tail.
After a while, it came to pass that an angel came to the Lord and said,
"Lord, Adam and Eve have become filled with pride. They strut and preen
like peacocks and they believe they are worthy of adoration. Dog has indeed
taught them that they are loved, but perhaps too well."
And God said, "No problem! I will create for them a companion who will be
with them forever and who will see them as they are. The companion will
remind them of their limitations, so they will know that they are not always
worthy of adoration."
And God created CAT to be a companion to Adam and Eve. And Cat would not
obey them. And when Adam and Eve gazed into Cat's eyes, they were reminded
that they were not the supreme beings. And Adam and Eve learned humility.
And they were greatly improved. And God was pleased.
And Dog was happy.
And Cat didn't give a sh!t one way or the other.<<
8^)
-JovBill
------------------------------------------------------------
Article 21725
From: Bill Dauphin
Date: Fri, 06 Sep 2002 01:33:39 -0400
Subject: Mara Update, and A Modest Invitation
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum
All:
Just thought I'd let you know how things are with Mara. (For new chums/new
lurkers, Mara is my 11 year old daughter who had a malignant brain tumor
removed about this time last year.)
She's got a couple short chemo treatments left to go in order to complete
her protocol, but last week she started 7th grade on schedule. She's very
excited to be back in "real" school after having done 6th grade at home with
a tutor last year. She'll have to miss a few days during the first term, but
the school is being very accommodating, and we expect no big problems. So
far, all her scans and tests continue to be A-OK, and she shows no signs of
lasting side effects from either the chemo or radiation (to be fair, some of
the potential side effects wouldn't show up 'til later in life anyway, but
still...).
Anne has also returned to work, and I'm back in my Master's program, and
we're slowly transitioning back to "normal" life. Oddly enough, that's not
an unmixed blessing: The clinic and hospital staff, the other patients and
their families, and the folks at our insurance company have formed such a
wonderful support system that there's a certain amount of separation anxiety
attached to leaving that routine behind. Still and all, things here are
Good.
Now for the invitation: At some point during the summer, I got a wild hair
in my beard and signed up to run in the Greater Hartford Marathon. No, not
the marathon distance; I'm running in the 5K race that's part of the overall
race weekend. Since I haven't run regularly in about 15 years and, aside
from a few forays into hiking, having done anything really active on a
regular basis for about 5 years, even a measly 5K will be quite a challenge
for me.
Now, races like this are usually run as charity fundraisers, and IIRC this
one supports (through entry fees and sponsorships) the Leukemia and Lymphoma
Society, among other charities. Runners also sometimes collect pledges for
charity as well. Since I signed up on a spur-of-the-moment basis, I'm not
formally associated with any charity, but I'd like to use my run to express
the gratitude we feel for the care Mara has received, and to that end, I'm
inviting my friends to pledge a small donation.
When you have a kid with cancer, the hospital becomes your home away from
home. In our case, the 8th (Hematology/Oncology) floor of the Connecticut
Children's Medical Center has been a loving and comforting home indeed.
After talking with the Hem/Onc group's clinical social worker, I've hit on a
couple simple, inexpensive items I (we <g>) could donate that would make it
an even more comfortable home for future patient families: answering
machines for the in-room phones and real remote controls for the TVs/VCRs
(the remote that's built into the nurse call button is almost useless).
These items cost only a few dollars each; with only a double handful of
folks pledging, I could conceivably outfit the entire floor.
I'll accept any sort of pledge in any amount, of course, but I thought we
might turn it into a sort of wager, just to make it interesting: I'd like to
suggest a basic pledge of $10 for finishing the race, plus an additional
dollar for every minute *under* 35 my actual time is. To put this in
perspective, my goal is 30 minutes, which works out to just under a 10
minute per mile pace. To date, in what little training I've been able to do,
I've run at that pace for up to about 2 miles (i.e., 2/3 of the race
distance), and the best I've been able to do for the entire distance is just
under 33 minutes. The race date is October 11, so I've got just over a month
to train. I think it's barely possible I'll get down to 30 minutes; I doubt
I'll get much better than that.
To make things more interesting, for each person that pledges, I will myself
(on top of my private pledge) pledge $1 for finishing and $0.10 for each
minute *over* 25. Thus, if 10 of you pledge and I hit my 30 minute goal
exactly, I'd be pledging as much as each of you (plus doing the running, of
course).
I'm serious, BTW, about the word "invitation": If this sounds like something
you'd *like* to do, something that would make you happy, then please join
me... but please don't feel any sense of obligation if the spirit doesn't
move you. Normally I would never solicit money from friends; I just feel a
strong desire to give at this moment in my life, and I thought I'd share the
opportunity. If you're interested, please respond by e-mail
(dauphinb@ix.netcom.com).
TIA...
-JovBill
------------------------------------------------------------
Article 21726
From: Randalt"
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2002 02:25:20 -0500
Subject: Re: Activate Deflector Screens
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum
This sounds like such an obvious thing to do now that they've actually done
it. So can we call this "active" reactive armour to differentiate from the
"passive" method of a chemical explosive charge between two armour plates
that's been around for some time?
-Randalt
<filksinger@earthling.net> wrote in message news:3d63d454.0@news.sff.net...
> Well, it isn't deflector screens yet, but the British have developed
electric
> anti-shaped charge "shields".
>
> http://www.washtimes.com/world/20020820-86081662.htm
> --
> Filksinger
> AKA David Nasset, Sr.
> Geek Prophet to the Technologically Declined
------------------------------------------------------------
Article 21727
From: hf_jai@prodigy.net (Jai Johnson-Pickett)
Date: Fri, 06 Sep 2002 14:11:31 GMT
Subject: Re: Out of Control?
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum
On Thu, 5 Sep 2002 14:16:34 -0500, "Dee" <ke4lfgDELETETHIS@amsat.org>
wrote:
>Jai--
> I don;t think 'rita meant you, personally. Especially since she started
>with "we", I suspect that was an impersonal you, including even heself. And
>most of us would benefit from broadening our horizons.
Hmmm..., you may be right, D2. If so, I apologize for over-reacting.
I do agree that ALL of us can benefit from learning more about people
different from us, around the world and here at home.
>> The let's-all-get-to-know-each-other-and-be-friends approach is just
>> not gonna work.
>
> Agreed, if you mean won't work to stop the terrorism. But getting to
>know each other might help us remember that not all Muslims are terrorists,
>and not all terrorists are Muslims, which I think is where 'rita was going.
>Some of us lose focus sometimes, and need to remind ourselves that, while
>the threat is very real, it may not be simple.
I also certainly agree that not all Muslims are terrorists, nor all
terrorists Muslim. That said, I think it IS relatively simple that we
were attacked by some very bad people, and that it is likely that they
will attack us again. Yes, there are reasons they attacked us, and
perhaps even more complex reasons that some other people support them
for attacking us. Some of the reasons (but not all) may even be
valid--we (Americans) are far from perfect and there are probably many
aspects of our behavior around the world that need vast improvement.
But I think we make a mistake if we allow consideration of foreign
attitudes to confuse the basic issues of good and evil,
self-protection, and even survival. It is important to "know your
enemy." It is equally important to remember who your enemy is.
However, while not all Muslims are terrorists (I know some who are
great people, and I'm sure that the majority, at least in this
country, are as good as the members of any other religious group), I
am greatly disappointed in the Muslim community as a whole in their
reaction to 9/11 specifically and to Islamic terrorism in general.
Yes, a (relatively) few of them spoke out to condemn bin Laden in the
wake of the WTC--Mohammad Ali was especially moving, perhaps partly
because of his physical disability, but he sure seemed sincere (and
I'm not a big Ali fan)--but I don't see any major Islamic effort to
stop the terrorism world-wide, or even to root out the support cells
to be found in this country. And while I read one stirring account of
a Muslim youth who joined the US military to demonstrate his
patriotism, and I'm sure he is not unique, I would like to have seen
something more on the order of the large number of Japanese-Americans
who joined up after Pearl Harbor. But I'll grant you that I have also
been disappointed that more non-Muslim Americans have not enlisted,
and that the administration did not do more to encourage more public
sacrifice and involvement.
> As for you personally, professional and personal interest probably make
>you one of the more informed people on the Forum. But if 'rita was saying
>that, as a people we sometimes get tunnel vision, she's right, I think.
Yes, as a people we do. Lord knows we all have a tendency to believe
what we want to believe, what jives with the preconceptions and
stereotypes we carry around in our heads. And when I criticized the
Europeans for forgetting about dead Iraqi children in favor of their
MTV, well, Americans are probably even worse on that score. We are
too often only moved by the emotions of the moment. And sometimes
when the emotions abate, we forget about what stirred those emotions
in the first place. That goes for the photos of dead children, and
for the horror of a year ago next Wednesday.
>--Dee2
always the peace maker <g>
(which is a good thing, among friends)
------------------------------------------------------------
Article 21728
From: hf_jai@prodigy.net (Jai Johnson-Pickett)
Date: Fri, 06 Sep 2002 14:24:55 GMT
Subject: Re: Mara Update, and A Modest Invitation
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum
So glad to hear Mara is doing well, Bill. I know your difficulties
are far from over, and my thoughts and prayers will be with you. Hang
in there. I DO understand that it will be hard to make a break from
the hospital routine, but it's great that she, and you, appear to be
on the road back to a "normal" life (whatever that means with a
pre-teen <g>).
We're preparing for our own little adventure (a "walk" for juvenile
diabetes), but wish you the best of luck in soliciting funds for your
5K run. If you haven't run in a long time, be sure you don't overdo
it. You ain't getting any younger!
Jai
------------------------------------------------------------
Article 21729
From: filksinger@earthling.net
Date: 6 Sep 2002 15:16:29 GMT
Subject: Change in the Wind?
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum
Al-Jazeera is one of the major news sources in the Muslim world, and never
a big supporter of the US. For some time, al-Jazeera has been like many
Muslim news sources in the Arab world, supporting the belief that Al-Quaeda
and Osama bin-Ladin are innocent of the 9/11 attacks, that it was really
a Jewish or US plot, etc. It has appeared for some time that nothing the
US could do would change this, as they would accept no proof supplied by
the Western world. Video taped confessions, by all the top Al-Quadea members
and by everyone in jail, collectively, would just be denounced as video
trickery.
Now, al-Jazeera claims to have confessions, on video, direct from Al-Quaeda
members to their own reporters.
Maybe there's some hope after all.
http://www.abcnews.go.com/wire/World/reuters20020905_568.html?partner=earthlink
Filksinger
------------------------------------------------------------
Article 21730
From: Dee"
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2002 11:07:55 -0500
Subject: Re: Mara Update, and A Modest Invitation
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum
"Bill Dauphin" <dauphinb@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
news:B99DB673.444-dauphinb@ix.netcom.com...
<snip some wonderful news>
Bill--
That is great to hear, and thank you for posting!
For you and Jai, both, if you should ever get involved in organizing of
one of these events, and if it is going to be long enough to want some
communications posts for safety's sake, most Amateur Radio clubs will be
delighted to post operators at specific points, make sure no one misses
their turns, and call the "sag-wagon" or any other assistance, if needed.
Here we mostly do it with bike ride events--longer distances, more
complicated routes, easier to get hurt. At the last one, all our operators
brought extra water, so the bikers would have even more opportunities to
cool off than just the one or two "refreshment stands" set up on the route.
--Dee
------------------------------------------------------------
Article 21731
From: Dee"
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2002 12:43:29 -0500
Subject: Re: Out of Control?
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum
"Jai Johnson-Pickett" <hf_jai@prodigy.net> wrote in message
news:3d78aada.6454387@news.sff.net...
Lots of snipping of thoughtful comments. No intent to distort, just for
brevity.
> I also certainly agree that not all Muslims are terrorists, nor all
> terrorists Muslim. That said, I think it IS relatively simple that we
> were attacked by some very bad people, and that it is likely that they
> will attack us again.
Agreed, that part is simple. What's not so simple, at least for me, is
exactly who they (all) are, and what to do about it.
> And while I read one stirring account of
> a Muslim youth who joined the US military to demonstrate his
> patriotism, and I'm sure he is not unique, I would like to have seen
> something more on the order of the large number of Japanese-Americans
> who joined up after Pearl Harbor. But I'll grant you that I have also
> been disappointed that more non-Muslim Americans have not enlisted,
> and that the administration did not do more to encourage more public
> sacrifice and involvement.
Do you think that will change if and when we get a clear picture of what
we can and will do about the situation? Of course, I doubt the miltary has
any place for a middle-aged fat broad with bad knees, but maybe there is a
place to serve at home, too. Lots of civilian-type volunteers are getting
better prepared.
> always the peace maker <g>
> (which is a good thing, among friends)
Hey, I just hate to see what looks like a misunderstanding erupt into
animosity. Especially among good and thoughtful people. Besides, there is
a selfish motivation--I like to have a place to come to for good
conversation with good friends. <g>
------------------------------------------------------------
Article 21732
From: Lorrita Morgan"
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2002 15:31:59 -0700
Subject: Re: Out of Control?
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum
Jai and Dee,
I think in "gestalt" and gather in small divergent bits of data that seem
totally unrelated to make the big picture. In my mind, it is a clear image
sometimes not as in focus as it could or should be; but when I try to put
what I "see" into words it is so hard like trying to describe one of Diego
Rivera's later murals in detail and still be coherent and avoid
misunderstandings. (see a bit of what I mean about Rivera at
http://www.diegorivera.com/index.html)
There are details and nuances that are obvious to me that others are blind
to or that I just assume (a loaded word useful only in math class) that my
audience will "know" what I am talking about because we are Americans of a
certain age, background, or other ~shared~ experience. I should know better
after all these years of training, working, studying, etc. that no one ever
shares the SAME experience.
My answers are always in communicating and relating. The more "we" can
build relationships outside our current comfort zone; the more people there
are who are "us" and not the dreaded "them." I don't mean to put myself in
danger or engage in risky behavior to meet these new acquaintances not
necessarily friends or even possible friends. But to stay in my group cut
off from real people of other groups only getting my news and information
about other peoples from the media is only going to strengthen my
prejudices.
I do not mean to imply that we should not keep looking so-called muslims who
continue fight for what they think they are entitled to. Ishmael, Edom,
Midian and the rest of Abraham's ~other~ children squandered or sold their
inheritance. They continue to do so while oppressing their children, their
wives, and their sisters. Jai, I think we should agree to disagree on this
subject. There is a problem. It is as old as Sarai telling Abram to sleep
with Hagar. You and I will not solve it in this newsgroup.
My hands are killing me. Anything that sounds like an unfinished thought
probably is. Any word that seems out of place probably is. This flare is
getting way old.
--
Later,
`rita
http://pages.prodigy.net/lorrita-m/index.html
------------------------------------------------------------
Article 21733
From: Filksinger"
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2002 16:11:35 -0700
Subject: Re: Mara Update, and A Modest Invitation
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum
Bill Dauphin wrote:
> All:
>
> Just thought I'd let you know how things are with Mara. (For new
> chums/new lurkers, Mara is my 11 year old daughter who had a
> malignant brain tumor removed about this time last year.)
Thanks for the update. I am very pleased to here that Mara is doing better.
--
Filksinger
AKA David Nasset, Sr.
Geek Prophet to the Technologically Declined
------------------------------------------------------------
Article 21734
From: Filksinger"
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 2002 16:16:08 -0700
Subject: Re: Change in the Wind?
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum
Arrgghh!
I'm sorry, somewhere in my head, I mixed up al-Jazeerah with some other
(name now forgotten) Arabic newspaper.
Al-Jazeerah is _not_, and has never been, one of the rabble-rousing,
sycophantic, often-state-controlled newspapers. My apologies. I grabbed this
and typed it up, then later said, "Wait, did that say al-Jazeerah?"
Filksinger
filksinger@earthling.net wrote:
> Al-Jazeera is one of the major news sources in the Muslim world, and
> never a big supporter of the US. For some time, al-Jazeera has been
> like many Muslim news sources in the Arab world, supporting the
> belief that Al-Quaeda and Osama bin-Ladin are innocent of the 9/11
> attacks, that it was really a Jewish or US plot, etc. It has appeared
> for some time that nothing the US could do would change this, as they
> would accept no proof supplied by the Western world. Video taped
> confessions, by all the top Al-Quadea members and by everyone in
> jail, collectively, would just be denounced as video trickery.
>
> Now, al-Jazeera claims to have confessions, on video, direct from Al-
> Quaeda members to their own reporters.
>
> Maybe there's some hope after all.
>
>
http://www.abcnews.go.com/wire/World/reuters20020905_568.html?partner=earthl
ink
>
> Filksinger
------------------------------------------------------------
Article 21735
From: Lorrita Morgan"
Date: Sat, 7 Sep 2002 14:25:14 -0700
Subject: for Jai (and any other interested Parties)
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum
This is a link to a section of a larger story on faith post 9/11:
http://www.beliefnet.com/story/112/story_11238_5.html#antisem
The story "The Real Spiritual Impact of 9/11" starts at:
http://www.beliefnet.com/frameset.asp?pageLoc=story/112/story_11238_1.html&b
oardID=45096
I'm still chasing down [reading/following] the imbedded links. TMI for my
tired brain to process.
BTW, Happy New Year!
--
Later,
`rita
http://pages.prodigy.net/lorrita-m/index.html
------------------------------------------------------------
Article 21736
From: David M. Silver"
Date: Mon, 09 Sep 2002 21:54:28 -0700
Subject: Re: Mara Update, and A Modest Invitation
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum
Bill Dauphin wrote:
> All:
>
> Just thought I'd let you know how things are with Mara. (For new chums/new
> lurkers, Mara is my 11 year old daughter who had a malignant brain tumor
> removed about this time last year.)
>
> She's got a couple short chemo treatments left to go in order to complete
> her protocol, but last week she started 7th grade on schedule. She's very
> excited to be back in "real" school after having done 6th grade at home with
> a tutor last year. She'll have to miss a few days during the first term, but
> the school is being very accommodating, and we expect no big problems. So
> far, all her scans and tests continue to be A-OK, and she shows no signs of
> lasting side effects from either the chemo or radiation (to be fair, some of
> the potential side effects wouldn't show up 'til later in life anyway, but
> still...)
Glad to hear the news is so far, so good.
That was a nice bread and butter letter she sent us last year for the
book card, Jov Bill. May she send many more for more years than either
of us will count.
David
------------------------------------------------------------
Article 21737
From: SpaceCadet
Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2002 08:41:43 -0500
Subject: Something to Do
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum
To All,
Please commemorate September 11th.by donating blood at your
local blood bank. This gift of blood donation will help to
assure that our nation's emergency rooms and trauma centers
are prepared if, and when, the need arises. Although we
cannot restore the lives that were lost in last September's
tragedy, contributing to our country's blood supply will
help to save lives now, and in the future, by helping to
insure our nations hospitals are prepared should the need
arise.
NOTE: Please be aware that many common medications such as
antidepressants, antihistamines, and anticonvulsants do not
necessarily prevent a person from donating blood. If you
are taking regular medications, please check with you local
blood bank to see if you qualify to become a donor.
Please pass this message along. Thanks, Carol
------------------------------------------------------------
Article 21738
From: Charles Graft
Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 13:19:39 -0500
Subject: Re: Out of Control?
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum
All--
I am most pleased to note that our Prez has conceded that
(additional) congressional approval is necessary before initiating a
war. At least this proposed war.
The reason I used the term "additional" is that there are those who
contend that the anti terrorism legislation of about a year ago gives
him that authority. I disagree.
My own opinion? Yes, I think military action is justified. But I
am not sure where to start or where to stop.
--
<<Big Charlie>>
"Democracy is a form of worship. It is the worship of jackals by
jackasses." -- H. L. Menken
------------------------------------------------------------
Article 21739
From: kevin mcgillicuddy"
Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 21:01:31 -0500
Subject: Re: Something to Do
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum
Seconded.
But don't take any aspirin for three days before donating.
McKevin
"SpaceCadet" <cadozo@planet-save.com> wrote in message
news:3D7F4817.BA4D375A@planet-save.com...
> To All,
>
> Please commemorate September 11th.by donating blood at your
> local blood bank. This gift of blood donation will help to
> assure that our nation's emergency rooms and trauma centers
> are prepared if, and when, the need arises. Although we
> cannot restore the lives that were lost in last September's
> tragedy, contributing to our country's blood supply will
> help to save lives now, and in the future, by helping to
> insure our nations hospitals are prepared should the need
> arise.
>
> NOTE: Please be aware that many common medications such as
> antidepressants, antihistamines, and anticonvulsants do not
> necessarily prevent a person from donating blood. If you
> are taking regular medications, please check with you local
> blood bank to see if you qualify to become a donor.
>
> Please pass this message along. Thanks, Carol
------------------------------------------------------------
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