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Archive of:   sff.discuss.heinlein-forum
Archive desc: The Internet home for the Heinlein Forum
Archived by:  webnews@sff.net
Archive date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 07:40:11
============================================================

Article 22010
From: filksinger@earthling.net
Date: 13 Dec 2002 16:17:01 GMT
Subject: Vampire Ecology
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum

Here's an article that you may find interesting. Or disturbing. Or both.
It is an analysis that attempts to define the ecology of the vampire in
relation to its prey in the town of Sunnydale, CA, home of the short blonde
chick with the sharp wooden objects.

http://www.stanford.edu/~bthomas/vamp/vampecology.htm

Filksinger

------------------------------------------------------------
Article 22011
From: fader555@aol.com (Fader)
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 07:09:25 GMT
Subject: ST:Nemesis
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum

So anyone else seen it yet? I think that they screwed it up, some
storyline/continuity problems. Other than that not bad, good effects.

Fader

------------------------------------------------------------
Article 22012
From: Clay Steiner" 
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 02:38:51 -0700
Subject: Headline: "Europe's space quest keeps going up in smoke
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum

I can't call this a "de-lurk", as I haven't been back since I posted the
news of my new machine and then went and got myself armpit-deep (and with
arms-a-flailing) in trying to get my new voice-over business off the ground.
And please don't ask about the novel -- getting it over here onto this
machine has been my own little Bataan Death March. But, hey -- anything that
brings me back to the ground of the HF has to be counted as "it's all good"
in my book. This article did that very thing, had to share:

http://www.iol.co.za/index.phpclick_id=79&art_id=qw103978728197W253&set_id=1

Beware of "weirdwrap" on that link. I'll catch up in another post, but
probably not tonight/this morning.

BTW, WRT the headline: neither Cheech nor Chong could be reached for
comment. <GD&RVVF>

CplTed   (been WAY too long since I typed that... ;-)



------------------------------------------------------------
Article 22013
From: Clay Steiner" 
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 02:59:52 -0700
Subject: Re: Leonids
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum

I can, in typically late fashion, report about the same here in (near)
Denver. Intermittent cloud cover, occasionally interrupted by light
pollution in areas where there didn't used to be any. <sigh>

CplTed

> Nasty light pollution here in San Luis Obispo (roughly half-way between
> San Francisco and LA), with a full moon and proximity to a freeway,  but
> we had some good sights. My fellow residents and I went up to the roof
> and watched for about an hour; there were a few really intense ones and
> a minor one every 20 seconds or so around 2:30. The last two times I
> tried to see them it was either foggy or rainy, so I was glad to finally
> get to see them.
> Bob
>



------------------------------------------------------------
Article 22014
From: JT@REM0VE.sff.net (JT)
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 17:42:31 GMT
Subject: Re: ST:Nemesis
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum

On Sun, 15 Dec 2002 07:09:25 GMT, fader555@aol.com (Fader) wrote:

>So anyone else seen it yet? I think that they screwed it up, some
>storyline/continuity problems. Other than that not bad, good effects.
>
Not yet.  We plan to, but it probably won't be until after New Year's
unless by some miracle the babysitting stars align before then. ;)

I won't be reading the rest of the thread, don't be insulted!

JT


------------------------------------------------------------
Article 22015
From: JT@REM0VE.sff.net (JT)
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 17:42:31 GMT
Subject: Re: Headline: "Europe's space quest keeps going up in smoke
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum

On Sun, 15 Dec 2002 02:38:51 -0700, "Clay Steiner"
<claysteiner@SPAMTHIS.prodigy.net> wrote:
>And please don't ask about the novel -- getting it over here onto this
>machine has been my own little Bataan Death March. 

Hey, if you had issues with transferring data there are plenty of good
minds with ideas here.  Next time, ASK, fella!

>http://www.iol.co.za/index.phpclick_id=79&art_id=qw103978728197W253&set_id=1
>
>Beware of "weirdwrap" on that link. I'll catch up in another post, but
>probably not tonight/this morning.

The link didn't work for me, but I went to the root and browsed down
through the Science news and found the page you meant.  Interesting--I
thought the Ariane program was a serious player, seems there's trouble
enough for everyone to go around. 

Kinda interesting to be reading South African news....the internet is
a powerful tool, isn't it?

Welcome back, hope you can give the HF a few minutes a week!

JT

------------------------------------------------------------
Article 22016
From: debrule@dahoudek.com (Deb Houdek Rule)
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 19:39:09 GMT
Subject: Re: ST:Nemesis
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum

>So anyone else seen it yet? I think that they screwed it up, some
>storyline/continuity problems. Other than that not bad, good effects.

  We saw it yesterday. I liked it. It's a fine _episode_. I liked some
of the character advancement they made--particularly with Riker and
Troi, but would have liked to have seen more of that, both at the
beginning and the ending. Geordi and Dr. Crusher both got shuffled
into minor roles, but it's difficult to feature them all in a 2 hour
movie. 

  Some of the plot flaws that jump out are the same that jump out of
any Trek movie or tv show--what, only these 5 guys on the bridge can
do anything? What are the other thousand on the ship doing? 

  Good Trek, not great, if you waited for the DVD you probably
wouldn't feel any great loss though.


Deb  (D.A. Houdek) 
http://www.dahoudek.com
http://www.robertaheinlein.com
http://www.civilwarstlouis.com

------------------------------------------------------------
Article 22017
From: William Dennis" 
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 15:22:48 -0600
Subject: heinlein society newsletter seeks submissions
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum

(I sent the following message to board members of The Heinlein Society. I
am posting it here so that other THS members can get the message that I am
looking for articles. You've got to be a member of the Society to be
published in the newsletter)

Request for submissions:

The Heinlein Society Newsletter seeks articles for its next issue.

Society officers and chairs of all Society committees are asked to submit
an
article. Other society members who wish to write an article about Heinlein,
please let me know.

I am also looking for original art to use on the cover. We already have
plenty of photos, and I would to try line art, perhaps a scene from a
Heinlein story.

Payment for all submissions will consist of a hearty handshake and a warm
glow.

The deadline for submissions will be Wednesday, Jan. 15. Please e-mail
submissions to bill@billdennis.net .
--
Bill Dennis
http://billdennis.net
"I believe it is better to tell the truth than to lie. I believe that it is
better to be free than to be a slave. And I believe that it is better to
know than to be ignorant." -- H.L. Mencken

--
Bill Dennis
http://billdennis.net
"I believe it is better to tell the truth than to lie. I believe that it is
better to be free than to be a slave. And I believe that it is better to
know than to be ignorant." -- H.L. Mencken



------------------------------------------------------------
Article 22018
From: William J. Keaton" 
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 2002 23:45:08 -0500
Subject: Re: Headline: "Europe's space quest keeps going up in smoke
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum


"JT" <JT@REM0VE.sff.net> wrote
> through the Science news and found the page you meant.  Interesting--I
> thought the Ariane program was a serious player, seems there's trouble
> enough for everyone to go around.

Arianespace has been a serious player. The Ariane 5 has been a troublesome
piece of work. I'm worried that they won't be able to find insurers willing
to underwrite satellites launched on A5. So the European Space Agency could
try to self-insure, but who can afford to pay off on 1 of 4.25 launches?

The odd thing is the nature of the failures: The first launch, a
catastrophic failure, was software. The other failures have been more
varied* suggesting a systems integration problem with ESA.

So Delta 4 and Titan could be big winners for Boeing and Lockheed Martin.
Unfortunately, there will be no winners, as the global satellite launch
market continues to shrink.

WJaKe

*Varied causes:
Software design - the flight control software was not designed to handle the
full range of dynamics the vehicle would experience. Shortly after launch it
couldn't figure out where it was! The rocket got lost, and the rocket was
lost.

water in upper stage engine - water is used to pressure test the engine
systems.

ran out of fuel in upper stage - (seriously! a problem with the coupling
that measures fuel mixture resulted in the engine burning more of one
propellant than the other.

Main engine pressure - latest launch failure, still being investigated.




------------------------------------------------------------
Article 22019
From: Voxwoman 
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 08:55:40 -0500
Subject: Re: ST:Nemesis
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum



Deb Houdek Rule wrote:

>>So anyone else seen it yet? I think that they screwed it up, some
>>storyline/continuity problems. Other than that not bad, good effects.
>>
> 
>   We saw it yesterday. I liked it. It's a fine _episode_. I liked some
> of the character advancement they made--particularly with Riker and
> Troi, but would have liked to have seen more of that, both at the
> beginning and the ending. Geordi and Dr. Crusher both got shuffled
> into minor roles, but it's difficult to feature them all in a 2 hour
> movie. 
> 
>   Some of the plot flaws that jump out are the same that jump out of
> any Trek movie or tv show--what, only these 5 guys on the bridge can
> do anything? What are the other thousand on the ship doing? 



spoiler alert....

..
..
..
..
..
..
..
..
..
..
..
..
..
..
..
..


What annoyed *me* no end was that they went to such great lengths 
explaining the Neman's sensitivity to light, and then they did nothing 
to use that information to their tactical advantage when they boarded 
the Enterprise. At least give the goblins some sunglasses, or have Riker 
shout "Computer! Lights: maximum!"

And I don't like the "out" they gave for Data... makes his sacrifice 
less meaningful, IMHO.


> 
>   Good Trek, not great, if you waited for the DVD you probably
> wouldn't feel any great loss though.


I agree completely. And I'm not sure I'll be adding this to the DVD 
collection.

-Wendy of NJ


> 
> 
> Deb  (D.A. Houdek) 
> http://www.dahoudek.com
> http://www.robertaheinlein.com
> http://www.civilwarstlouis.com
> 


-- 
----------
support independent music!
http://www.musicforthegoddess.com
remove nogoons to reply


------------------------------------------------------------
Article 22020
From: debrule@dahoudek.com (Deb Houdek Rule)
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 2002 19:32:54 GMT
Subject: Re: ST:Nemesis
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum


>spoiler alert....
>
>.
>.
>.
>.
>.
>.
>.
>.
>.
>.
>.
>.
>.
>.
>.
>.
>
>
>What annoyed *me* no end was that they went to such great lengths 
>explaining the Neman's sensitivity to light, and then they did nothing 
>to use that information to their tactical advantage when they boarded 
>the Enterprise. At least give the goblins some sunglasses, or have Riker 
>shout "Computer! Lights: maximum!"

  Good point. When the bad guys boarded was also one of those 'where
are the other 1000 crew members' moments. They have to take the 1st
officer and tactical officer off the bridge during a battle to deal
with a couple intruders? 

  Seems to be a rule--any time Deanna drives the ship it gets
smooshed. ;-)

  I thought it showed a lack of understanding of the audience and what
we want that they didn't show more of Riker and Troi's wedding, both
at the beginning and the Betazed one at the end--I'm interested in the
characters, not just any old random sf-ish battle plotline.  Surely by
this point in the franchise they don't think anyone goes to a Trek
movie _despite_ it being Trek, rather than _because_. All plotlines
and their success hinge on how these characters we know deal with
it--I'd be happy with a movie that had no new external characters or
situations added, one completely involving the Trek crew. 


Deb  (D.A. Houdek) 
http://www.dahoudek.com
http://www.robertaheinlein.com
http://www.civilwarstlouis.com

------------------------------------------------------------
Article 22021
From: filksinger@earthling.net
Date: 17 Dec 2002 15:15:38 GMT
Subject: WRAPPING PRESENTS WITH A CAT
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum

Got this in my email at work:

************


WRAPPING PRESENTS WITH A CAT 

1. Clear large space on table for wrapping present. 

2. Go to wardrobe and collect bag in which present is contained, and close
door. 

3. Open door and remove cat from wardrobe. 

4. Go to cupboard and retrieve rolls of wrapping paper. 

5. Go back and remove cat from cupboard. 

6. Go to drawer and collect transparent sticky tape, ribbons, scissors,
labels, etc. 

7. Lay out present and wrapping materials on table, to enable wrapping strategy
to be formed. 

8. Go back to drawer to get string, remove cat that has been in the drawer
since last visit, and collect string. 

9. Remove present from bag. 

10. Remove cat from bag. 

11. Open box to check present, remove cat from box, replace present. 

12. Lay out paper to enable cutting to size. 

13. Cut the paper to size, trying to keep the cutting line straight. 

14. Throw away first sheet because cat tried to chase the scissors and tore
paper. 

15. Cut second sheet of paper to size by putting cat in the bag the present
came out of. 

16. Place present on cut-to-size paper. 

17. Lift up edges of paper to seal in present, wonder why edges now don't
reach, and find cat between present and paper. Remove cat and retry. 

18. Place object on paper, to hold in place, while cutting transparent sticky
tape. 

19. Spend next 20 minutes carefully trying to remove transparent sticky
tape from cat with pair of nail scissors. 

20. Seal paper down with transparent sticky tape, making corners as neat
as possible. 

21. Look for roll of ribbon; chase cat down hall and retrieve ribbon. 

22. Try to wrap present with ribbon in a two-directional turn. 

23. Re-roll up ribbon and remove paper that is now torn, due to cat's enthusiasm
in chasing ribbon end. 

24. Repeat steps 12-22 until down to last sheet of paper. 

25. Decide to skip steps 12-16 in order to save time and reduce risk of
losing last sheet of paper. Retrieve old cardboard box that you know is
right size for sheet of paper. 

26. Put present in box, and tie down with string. 

27. Remove string, open box and remove cat. 

28. Put all packing materials in bag with present and head for lockable
room. 


29. Once inside room, lock door and start to re-lay out packing materials.


30. Remove cat from box, unlock door, put cat outside door, close door and
re-lock. 

31. Lay out last sheet of paper. (Admittedly this is difficult in the small
area of the toilet, but try your best!) 

32. Seal box, wrap with paper and start repairs by very carefully sealing
down tears with transparent sticky tape. Now tie up with ribbon and decorate
with bows to hide worst affected areas. 

33. Label, then sit back and admire your handiwork, congratulating yourself
on making good of a bad job. 

34. Unlock door, and go to kitchen to make drink and feed cat. 

35. Spend next 15 minutes looking for cat, before coming to obvious conclusion.


36. Unwrap present, untie box and remove cat. 

37. Retrieve all discarded sheets of wrapping paper, feed cat and retire
to lockable room for last attempt, making certain you are alone and the
door is locked. 

38. At time of handing over present, smile sweetly at receiver's face, as
they try and hide their contempt at being handed such a badly wrapped present.


39. Swear to yourself that next year, you will get the store to wrap the
darn thing for you.

------------------------------------------------------------
Article 22022
From: fader555@aol.com (Fader)
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 06:06:52 GMT
Subject: Re: ST:Nemesis
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum

On Sun, 15 Dec 2002 07:09:25 GMT, fader555@aol.com (Fader) wrote:

>So anyone else seen it yet? I think that they screwed it up, some
>storyline/continuity problems. Other than that not bad, good effects.
>
spoilers:
















No mention of Lore, if I start finding body parts, when I find the
head & it looks like me, then "it looks like me" is only a realistic
response if - I DON'T HAVE A TWIN BROTHER, otherwise it looks like
him, after all I know it's not me.(alas, poor Yorick...)

The Data "out", we have seen the future, twice where Data is involved,
in both he has the "emotion chip" & I believe that such is even
mentioned in one of the instances. Even if B-4 can somehow
assimulate[sp?] Data's memories & "become" Data he ain't gonna have
that.

Fader


------------------------------------------------------------
Article 22023
From: Charles Graft 
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 07:35:58 -0500
Subject: Are we losing it?
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum


--------------F207ED052C9B51E811E4B378
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

From Joseph Sobran 12/3/2002

     And what will the war mean for ordinary Americans?  We are already
seeing sharp changes in our way of life as "national security" trumps
customary freedoms. American businesses, embassies, and tourists will
face increasing danger all over the world. At home, the power of the
state will expand, perhaps to totalitarian dimensions. Limited
government will
become an ever more distant memory.
     Not that most Americans will mind. In fact, many of them are
already clamoring for government powers to defeat terrorism They believe
in curtailing freedom in order to defend it. The government can count on
plenty of support for harsh and unconstitutional measures.
---------------------------------------------------------

    Well, people? True or false? Something to worry about, take action
against, or simply ignore?

    My take on it. As long as terrorism is the excuse for government
expansion, the problem will never be solved.
--
<<Big Charlie>>

"Democracy is a form of worship.  It is the worship of jackals by
jackasses." --  H. L. Menken


--------------F207ED052C9B51E811E4B378
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

<!doctype html public "-//w3c//dtd html 4.0 transitional//en">
<html>
From Joseph Sobran 12/3/2002
<p><i>     And what will the war mean for ordinary
Americans?  We are already seeing sharp changes in our way of life
as "national security" trumps customary freedoms. American businesses,
embassies, and tourists will face increasing danger all over the world.
At home, the power of the state will expand, perhaps to totalitarian dimensions.
Limited government will</i>
<br><i>become an ever more distant memory.</i>
<br><i>     Not that most Americans will mind. In fact,
many of them are already clamoring for government powers to defeat terrorism
They believe in curtailing freedom in order to defend it. The government
can count on plenty of support for harsh and unconstitutional measures.</i>
<br>---------------------------------------------------------
<p>    Well, people? True or false? Something to worry about,
take action against, or simply ignore?
<p>    My take on it. As long as terrorism is the excuse
for government expansion, the problem will never be solved.
<br>--
<br><<Big Charlie>>
<p>"Democracy is a form of worship.  It is the worship of jackals
by jackasses." --  H. L. Menken
<br> </html>

--------------F207ED052C9B51E811E4B378--


------------------------------------------------------------
Article 22024
From: Charles Graft 
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 16:10:45 -0500
Subject: Coincidence?  Nah.
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum

All--
     There seems to be a bit of RAH in the Clive Cussler book
"Cyclops".  In it there is a character who uses the name "Anson".  But
more to the point, there is an attack on an established moon base by a
highly trained (in this case, Russian) military squad which is defeated
in large part by their inexperience with conditions on the moon.

    Anyone else read Cussler?



--
<<Big Charlie>>

"Democracy is a form of worship.  It is the worship of jackals by
jackasses." --  H. L. Menken



------------------------------------------------------------
Article 22025
From: noone" 
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 2002 03:15:24 -0500
Subject: Re: Coincidence?  Nah.
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum

"Anyone else read Cussler?"
----------------
not yet but from the sound of your description i think i might want to.
"gunner"

"Charles Graft" <chasgraft@aol.com> wrote in message
news:3E0235D5.C8D9D002@aol.com...
> All--
>      There seems to be a bit of RAH in the Clive Cussler book
> "Cyclops".  In it there is a character who uses the name "Anson".  But
> more to the point, there is an attack on an established moon base by a
> highly trained (in this case, Russian) military squad which is defeated
> in large part by their inexperience with conditions on the moon.
>
>     Anyone else read Cussler?
>
>
>
> --
> <<Big Charlie>>
>
> "Democracy is a form of worship.  It is the worship of jackals by
> jackasses." --  H. L. Menken
>
>
>



------------------------------------------------------------
Article 22026
From: Gordon G. Sollars 
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 2002 21:04:32 -0500
Subject: test
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum

zzxxyy
-- 
Gordon Sollars
gsollars@pobox.com

------------------------------------------------------------
Article 22027
From: Gordon G. Sollars 
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 2002 22:52:02 -0500
Subject: Re: Are we losing it?
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum

In article <3E01BD2E.2ADBD239@aol.com>, chasgraft@aol.com says...

>     Well, people? True or false? Something to worry about, take action
> against, or simply ignore?
> 
>     My take on it. As long as terrorism is the excuse for government
> expansion, the problem will never be solved.

Terrorism is one of the best illustrations of the "Tar Baby Principle": 
you become attached to what you attack.

-- 
Gordon Sollars
gsollars@pobox.com

------------------------------------------------------------
Article 22028
From: Eli Hestermann 
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 2002 07:19:49 -0500
Subject: Re: test
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum

ccvvuu
--
Eli V. Hestermann
ehestermann@tmlp.com
"Vita brevis est, ars longa" - Seneca



------------------------------------------------------------
Article 22029
From: Eli Hestermann 
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 2002 07:22:04 -0500
Subject: Re: Coincidence?  Nah.
Newsgroups: sff.discuss.heinlein-forum

Charles Graft wrote:

> All--
>      There seems to be a bit of RAH in the Clive Cussler book
> "Cyclops".  In it there is a character who uses the name "Anson".  But
> more to the point, there is an attack on an established moon base by a
> highly trained (in this case, Russian) military squad which is defeated
> in large part by their inexperience with conditions on the moon.

Does sound like an homage.

>     Anyone else read Cussler?

I read a couple of his books a few years ago, and thought his stuff read
like a Clancy wannabe.

--
Eli V. Hestermann
ehestermann@tmlp.com
"Vita brevis est, ars longa" - Seneca



------------------------------------------------------------

============================================================
Archive of:   sff.discuss.heinlein-forum
Archive desc: The Internet home for the Heinlein Forum
Archived by:  webnews@sff.net
Archive date: Wed, 05 Feb 2003 07:40:11
First article in this archive:  22010
Last article in this archive:   22029
Oldest article in this archive: 13 Dec 2002 16:17:01 GMT
Newest article in this archive: Mon, 23 Dec 2002 15:53:07 -0800